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Author Topic: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT  (Read 106044 times)

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Offline FedUp

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #390 on: May 25, 2008, 11:36:49 AM »

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Offline Valor7

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #391 on: May 25, 2008, 01:01:41 PM »
Thanks JB looking forward to it.

The one on the inmate per diem was in the DG a few weeks ago but I failed to save that article.
JB

Offline cowboy

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #392 on: May 25, 2008, 04:15:18 PM »
If I remember correctly they recommended an increase in the amount of $0.25 per day per inmate. So it would go from $21.25 to $21.50? This increase, however, was not voted on. With the new on-line system at the DG they don't now carry all the same stories they did in the past but if you put "inmate cost" in the search box it will show you the article.

Offline FedUp

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #393 on: May 26, 2008, 06:19:01 PM »
Thanks Cowboy I'll look it up. JB that's applies only to state inmates correct or is it for all? 

Offline Valor7

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #394 on: May 27, 2008, 01:10:45 AM »
Only state charges. The County sentence inmates do not count. Right now we have about $63,000.00 in sentences being served by county inmates.
JB

Offline FedUp

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #395 on: May 27, 2008, 02:25:18 PM »
Only state charges. The County sentence inmates do not count. Right now we have about $63,000.00 in sentences being served by county inmates.
JB

Thanks JB.  On average, about how many inmates at any given time are state inmates?  On average now, I know it changes hour to hour.  You had mentioned earlier that we had, at that time, 65 on the inmate list, about how many, approximately, of that 65 would be state prisoners?  Any federal?

Offline Valor7

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #396 on: May 27, 2008, 11:41:20 PM »
The only time we house a Federal inmate is when he is sent here on a writ to appear on a state charge.

On the whole 95% of all our inmates or more are state charges. We had 77 people today. And 44 were housed away from here. We had been running about 65-66 per day until the great raid. Not sure where we will settle down now. Of the 65 all but maybe one or two would be state.

You do the math 44 inmtes X $35.00 per day X whatever number of days you chose.

        JB

Offline FedUp

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #397 on: May 28, 2008, 12:54:40 AM »
The only time we house a Federal inmate is when he is sent here on a writ to appear on a state charge.

On the whole 95% of all our inmates or more are state charges. We had 77 people today. And 44 were housed away from here. We had been running about 65-66 per day until the great raid. Not sure where we will settle down now. Of the 65 all but maybe one or two would be state.

You do the math 44 inmtes X $35.00 per day X whatever number of days you chose.

        JB
Thanks JB. If I can get my old rusty wheels turning I'll do the math.
 

Sheriff J. B. King

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #398 on: May 29, 2008, 09:41:40 PM »
If I remember correctly they recommended an increase in the amount of $0.25 per day per inmate. So it would go from $21.25 to $21.50? This increase, however, was not voted on. With the new on-line system at the DG they don't now carry all the same stories they did in the past but if you put "inmate cost" in the search box it will show you the article.


      OK, I talked to Sen. Barnetiz's secretary this morning and she said they raised it $0.75 per day up to $22.00 total.

         JB

Offline 02Tundra

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #399 on: May 30, 2008, 05:25:07 PM »
So, the County still has a $13.00 delta for each inmate, daily?

Sheriff J. B. King

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #400 on: May 30, 2008, 06:02:30 PM »
So, the County still has a $13.00 delta for each inmate, daily?

   For the ones housed away from here Yes. For the one's housed here I am not sure what the figure is we have never come up with a solid figure as to exactly what it costs us to house here.
The last attempt i made came out at about $25.00 per day from memory.
JB

Offline matrsnot

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #401 on: May 30, 2008, 06:11:24 PM »
Up .75 a day huh?  Thank the Senate for the scrooge like amount.  The House did fine.  It was the Senate that put a hiatus in any respectable amount of monies to be reimbursed.  They make the law and then fail to fund it.

Sheriff J. B. King

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #402 on: May 30, 2008, 06:14:15 PM »
Up .75 a day huh?  Thank the Senate for the scrooge like additon.  The House did fine.  It was the Senat that put a hiatus in any respectable amount of monies to be remibursed.  They make the law and then fail to fund it.


   They are not alone. We have an ICE client in custody. Got him this AM and they will come get him Tues. next week we hope but we hold him in the meantime at $35.00 that they will not pay.
JB

Offline 02Tundra

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #403 on: May 30, 2008, 07:49:20 PM »
I can see how we could use a new jail with prices like that.  I can also see why the other Counties with large new jails love to see one of our vehicles pulling into their jail parking lot.  They make a pretty good windfall off of housing other Counties prisoners don't they?

Offline Yankee Trader

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #404 on: May 30, 2008, 08:21:34 PM »
02 You have hit the nail on the head!!

Offline pulaskiivoter

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #405 on: May 30, 2008, 10:33:38 PM »
This has probably been asked before but I don't understand why the Ambulance district money and the 911 board money can't be reallocated for all emergency services Fire, ems, 911 and law enforcement.  I am not stirring the pot, but I can't seem to grasp this.

Offline FedUp

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #406 on: May 30, 2008, 11:56:56 PM »
02 You have hit the nail on the head!!

OK, how much will it cost to build a new jail, get new cars, have a county SWAT team, increase better pay for the deputies and add more deputies?

Offline Valor7

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #407 on: May 31, 2008, 02:01:05 AM »

OK, how much will it cost to build a new jail, get new cars, have a county SWAT team, increase better pay for the deputies and add more deputies?

    By this time tomorrow the County SWAT team should be fully in business. We do the final tests tomorrow. As to the other it can be done with a one cent total additional sales tax. 1/2 cent to save the dept. and 1/2 cent to build and staff the jail. Provided the other necessary budget modifications are made such as jail money back from the state goes to the jail budget and not the general revenue fund. We would need to change from our current budget model to the one Phelps County uses. Jail would be done much faster with a one cent jail and 1/2 cent staff sales tax and sunset the jail tax at a reasonable time frame.

          None of which is going to happen.

            JB

Offline Yankee Trader

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #408 on: May 31, 2008, 02:10:50 AM »
And other counties have done it successfully and run a profitable jail business thus benefiting their County.

Sheriff J. B. King

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #409 on: May 31, 2008, 04:47:07 PM »
    By this time tomorrow the County SWAT team should be fully in business. We do the final tests tomorrow. As to the other it can be done with a one cent total additional sales tax. 1/2 cent to save the dept. and 1/2 cent to build and staff the jail. Provided the other necessary budget modifications are made such as jail money back from the state goes to the jail budget and not the general revenue fund. We would need to change from our current budget model to the one Phelps County uses. Jail would be done much faster with a one cent jail and 1/2 cent staff sales tax and sunset the jail tax at a reasonable time frame.

          None of which is going to happen.

            JB


              I need to make sure that every one understands that when you are dealing with a $12 or so million dollar project and a staff of 30 or more people that the numbers get big real quick and they seem to go on forever. Any change in the requirements, specifications, etc. has an impact on the totals so in the above quote I am NOT citing specific numbers just ball park type numbers.

           JB

Offline FedUp

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #410 on: May 31, 2008, 06:46:02 PM »

              I need to make sure that every one understands that when you are dealing with a $12 or so million dollar project and a staff of 30 or more people that the numbers get big real quick and they seem to go on forever. Any change in the requirements, specifications, etc. has an impact on the totals so in the above quote I am NOT citing specific numbers just ball park type numbers.

           JB
JB what I was looking for was totals, for instance what is the total estimated amount for a new jail, total estimated amount for the new vehicles, total estimated amount for an increase in deputy pay, total estimated amount for more deputies, total estimated cost for the county SWAT team (isn't that an increase in personnel). 

Offline Valor7

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #411 on: June 01, 2008, 03:36:09 PM »
JB what I was looking for was totals, for instance what is the total estimated amount for a new jail, total estimated amount for the new vehicles, total estimated amount for an increase in deputy pay, total estimated amount for more deputies, total estimated cost for the county SWAT team (isn't that an increase in personnel). 

    SWAT on line and operational as of last night. No increase in manpower we used a combo of paid and reserve officers to man the team. We recieved several donations and used some of my fund money to equip them. I have abouut $2K more to fund for equipment.

As to the other figures, It would be a waste of my time to total those until I see some kind of actual movement toward a tax. Other factors have changed such as Deputy salary. The Missouri Sheriff's Association bill has passed and we wait for the Gov. to sign. That will in large part take care of the salary issues as to the raise but not any increase in manpower.

As to the vehicles we need to set up a revolving fund like the MSHP and fund our cars that way. It would not be the complete solution but many steps in the right direction.

But, I can go out on a limb. Roughly $15M for the jail. A staff and operate budget of about $1.8M per year for the jail. A total of $2.3M  a year for the dept. without the jail added and we would have a first class operation.

And yes I just did this off the top of my head so Yes the figures can be trimmed. But this would be ballpark.

   JB

Offline cowboy

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #412 on: June 01, 2008, 03:44:40 PM »
   

As to the other figures, It would be a waste of my time to total those until I see some kind of actual movement toward a tax.

We always did a 10 year plan (5 firm, 5 Forecast) before we ask for the money.   That way everyone knew what we needed, what it was for and the justification.

Offline FedUp

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #413 on: June 05, 2008, 11:42:49 PM »
We always did a 10 year plan (5 firm, 5 Forecast) before we ask for the money.   That way everyone knew what we needed, what it was for and the justification.
Cowboy that's why I was asking for the estimated totals.  And I understand they are estimates.  JB my ole rusty wheels are slowly turning, will have a comment in a few days.
 

WET_VETTE

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #414 on: August 08, 2008, 01:20:44 AM »
Ive been reading recent DG comments re: a wedding party gone wrong, a deputy and children, Im sure SOMEONE knows...was this deputy the only LE on scene?  (the answer will tie into this topic)

Offline ShowmeHillbilly

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #415 on: August 08, 2008, 01:27:08 AM »
You need to ask 3kittens about this... it was her wedding. and yes the officer did pull a gun on all of the ones there and made them get on the ground with their children there. (my understanding is he wanted to control the situation and this was his way of doing it) If you want to know the details then ask them personally. I wasnt there... only was told about what happened the next day and  i couldnt believe some of the people he did it too and especially over the situation. To me it was uncalled for IMHO. They were all humiliated let alone mad.
 
 
Ive been reading recent DG comments re: a wedding party gone wrong, a deputy and children, Im sure SOMEONE knows...was this deputy the only LE on scene?  (the answer will tie into this topic)
You never know how STRONG you are...until being strong is the ONLY choice you have.
Life Isnt about waiting for the storm to pass...Its about learning to dance in the rain.
Someday someone will walk into your life & make you realize why it never worked out with anyone else!

WET_VETTE

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #416 on: August 08, 2008, 03:00:40 AM »
Well, I was  thinking..a good example to use for the cause to vote yes for a LE tax. I suppose you could think of it in several different ways.
 
1. Lack of manpower? Regardless of how the deputy ended up at the scene, whether hostile or not, 12 to 1 doesnt sound like a fair deal. Yes to a tax, yes to increased funds for more personnel.
2. Unqualified or not, the best person for the job?.  Yes to tax = yes to increased funds to entice highly trained, qualified personnel join the force and stay on, < turnover.
3. Stressed out, overworked = bad decision. Yes to tax = more manpower again, < the "spread to thin force".
 
Obviously I dont know the details. But just looking in on the situation, it scares me. Hopefully the children involved will not keep for long an ill impression of LE.  Unfortunately, people have to do the best the can with what they have (resources, information, ect). And fortunately, it wasnt my family, because I cant imagine how that would have played out.  Just a thought.
 
Vote yes, if our almighty rulers ever give us the opportunity.

Offline Yankee Trader

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #417 on: August 08, 2008, 03:11:04 AM »
When did this happen?

Offline ShowmeHillbilly

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #418 on: August 08, 2008, 09:25:44 PM »
you would have to ask 3 kittens I cant remember what day she got married but it wasnt that long ago.
 
I know if it was me I wouldnt be letting it go. But thats me. I dont cause any trouble and have never been in trouble with the law and I be danged if I had a gun pulled on me especially in front of my children!
 
Some of them were even hand cuffed for no reason except they were pretty big sized people and they had never been in trouble with the law EVER.
 
When did this happen?
You never know how STRONG you are...until being strong is the ONLY choice you have.
Life Isnt about waiting for the storm to pass...Its about learning to dance in the rain.
Someday someone will walk into your life & make you realize why it never worked out with anyone else!

Offline matrsnot

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Re: TAXES FOR LAW ENFORCMENT
« Reply #419 on: August 08, 2008, 10:41:53 PM »
    By this time tomorrow the County SWAT team should be fully in business. We do the final tests tomorrow. As to the other it can be done with a one cent total additional sales tax. 1/2 cent to save the dept. and 1/2 cent to build and staff the jail. Provided the other necessary budget modifications are made such as jail money back from the state goes to the jail budget and not the general revenue fund. We would need to change from our current budget model to the one Phelps County uses. Jail would be done much faster with a one cent jail and 1/2 cent staff sales tax and sunset the jail tax at a reasonable time frame.

          None of which is going to happen.

            JB
Sorry, I disagree with SWAT.  I have been reading way too many abuses by these teams.  Check out the one in Maryland where the police busted a Mayor (incorrectly) and shot both his dogs.  Check out the murder in Atlanta by police of a 90+ year old woman when they broke into her house and she defended herself.  Check out Ruby Ridge and Waco for abuses.  They can happen anywhere.  We are also subject to criminals dressing up in black and doing home invasions claiming to be police.  No knock warrants are a BIG no-no.  Everybody loses when this kind of raid is conducted.  Everybody.  And inevitably, someone or something is going to die.  Too often, the police are misled by a "confidential informant" who wants lighter sentence.  Too often innocent families are brutalized, cuffed and their property confiscated (read stolen).  Sorry if it seems I am not supporting LE, but I do not and have never supported SWAT or the no knock warrant approach to cowing citizens into absolute obedience.