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Author Topic: A Strong Lesson from Argentina  (Read 2955 times)

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Offline fish

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A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« on: March 20, 2010, 09:14:00 PM »

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 A Strong Lesson From Argentina

In the early 20th century,   Argentina  was one of the richest countries in the world. While   Great Britain 's maritime power and its far-flung empire had propelled it to a dominant position among the world's industrialized nations, only the   United States  challenged   Argentina  for the position of the world's second-most powerful economy.

It was blessed with abundant agriculture, vast swaths of rich farmland laced with navigable rivers and an accessible port system. Its level of industrialization was higher than many European countries: railroads, automobiles and telephones were commonplace.

In 1916, a new president was elected. Hipólito Irigoyen had formed a party called The Radicals under the banner of "fundamental change" with an appeal to the middle class.  ("Fundamental change"... now where have I heard that?)

Among Irigoyen's changes: mandatory pension insurance, mandatory health insurance, and support for low-income housing construction to stimulate the economy. Put simply, the state assumed economic control of a vast swath of the country's operations and began assessing new payroll taxes to fund its efforts.  (Beginning to sound more familiar?)

With an increasing flow of funds into these entitlement programs, the government's payouts soon became overly generous. Before long its outlays surpassed the value of the taxpayers' contributions. Put simply, it quickly became under-funded, much like our Social Security and Medicare programs.  (And, more!)

The death knell for the Argentine economy, however, came with the election of Juan Perón. Perón had a fascist and corporatist upbringing; he and his charismatic wife aimed their populist rhetoric at the nation's rich. (Still more!)

This targeted group "swiftly expanded to cover most of the propertied middle classes, who became an enemy to be defeated and humiliated." (And, more!)

Under Perón, the size of government bureaucracies exploded through massive programs of social spending and by encouraging the growth of labor unions.  (Do you see the light?)

High taxes and economic mismanagement took their inevitable toll even after Perón had been driven from office. But his populist rhetoric and "contempt for economic realities" lived on. Argentina's federal government continued to spend far beyond its means.  (That can't happen here!)

Hyperinflation exploded in 1989, the final stage of a process characterized by "industrial protectionism, redistribution of income based on increased wages, and growing state intervention in the economy..."  (Never!)

The Argentinean government's practice of printing money to pay off its public debts had crushed the economy. Inflation hit 3000%, reminiscent of the  Weimar   Republic  . Food riots were rampant; stores were looted; the country descended into chaos.  (Impossible!)

And by 1994,   Argentina 's public pensions -- the equivalent of Social Security -- had imploded. The payroll tax had increased from 5% to 26%, but it wasn't enough. In addition,   Argentina had implemented a value-added tax (VAT), new income taxes, a personal tax on wealth, and additional revenues based upon the sale of public enterprises. These crushed the private sector, further damaging the economy.  (Only happens in those lesser countries!  NOT us!)

A government-controlled "privatization" effort to rescue seniors' pensions was attempted. But, by 2001, those funds had also been raided by the government, the monies replaced by Argentina 's defaulted government bonds.  (Hmmmm.... )

By 2002, "...government fiscal irresponsibility... induced a national economic crisis as severe as   America 's Great Depression."  (But, we won't let that happen again... will we?)
 
 
We've seen this movie before. The politician's populist plans NEVER work, because power corrupts and government bankrupts everything it touches. For those that will listen, history shouts over and over that we cannot sustain the wild spending and government takeover of business, banking, health care, and continue to inflate unfunded entitlement programs!  Like history tells us, it will be utter and complete disaster!!!
Today's politicians are guilty of more than arrogant stupidity; they are enslaving future generations to poverty and misery. And they will be long gone when it all implodes. They will be as cold and dead as Juan Perón when your children and grand children must ultimately pay for the blind arrogance of politicians!

THINK AMERICA!
 
WE ARE ALLOWING POLITICIANS TO  REPEAT THE FAILURES OF HISTORY!
THINK.... AND ACT ! !

PS... while working America cuts back... Congress just increased government expenditures by 12% in the "Omnibus" spending bill of nearly half a TRILLION!   
Last year there was ONE person in the Dept. of Transportation making over $170,000! 
This year that Dept. has 1690 people making over $170,000! 
Is your company, or ANY company, doing that well? 
AND, this bill has 5224 earmarks totaling $4,000,000,000!
 
http://www.ksfo.com/Article.asp?id=1656320&spid=10828

Offline Just_a_Biker

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2010, 11:21:50 PM »
Nah.  Can't happen to us.  Won't happen to us.  Rome.  Argentina.  USSR.  They just didn't know what they were doing.  Our politicians are smarter than that, they know what's best for us stupid little people that don't know enough to make up our own minds.  Besides, McDonald's will always be there to feed the hungry; although many will become upset because they have to wait in line for more than 30 seconds to get their food...
The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest Rome become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance. Cicero - 55 BC, Rome

Offline igahmah at work

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2010, 03:13:44 AM »
Biker, love your sarcasm! and I agree.
When I was young, I wanted to be older.  This is not what I expected!

Offline Vado Del Rio

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2010, 05:51:43 AM »
 :ehm:
 
PS... while working America cuts back... Congress just increased government expenditures by 12% in the "Omnibus" spending bill of nearly half a TRILLION!   
Last year there was ONE person in the Dept. of Transportation making over $170,000! 
This year that Dept. has 1690 people making over $170,000! 
Is your company, or ANY company, doing that well? 
AND, this bill has 5224 earmarks totaling $4,000,000,000!

I sure don't recall this being signed into law in the Rose Garden.  Perhaps it was passed (by passed) under the so called "Rangel Rule". provision.  For those of you unfamiliar with this powerful piece of manpower, Rangel, please see:
 
 
http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&source=hp&q=rangel beach photo&oq=&gs_rfai=&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=O7OlS6eND5CXtges3vmVCg&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CA8QsAQwAA

Offline Just_a_Biker

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2010, 07:23:45 PM »
Biker, love your sarcasm! and I agree.

Sarcasm is just one public service I offer completely free of charge  :poke:
The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest Rome become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance. Cicero - 55 BC, Rome

Offline freethinker

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2010, 07:36:21 PM »
i'm not even gonna bother with an arguement on this one....

i highly recommend those who read that fact check the information for yourself...   

allowing someone to sway your opinion by misrepresenting the facts simply because you would rather take their word for it as opposed to looking it up is not only lazy... it's harmful to the entire democratic process...   

Offline Vado Del Rio

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2010, 08:22:25 PM »
i'm not even gonna bother with an arguement on this one....

i highly recommend those who read that fact check the information for yourself...   

allowing someone to sway your opinion by misrepresenting the facts simply because you would rather take their word for it as opposed to looking it up is not only lazy... it's harmful to the entire democratic process...   

Most out here seem confident in their beliefs and I respect that.  I don't care what side of the aisle, party, or issue one takes.  That's what makes our society, country, and culture so unique.  What I don't appreciate are members of congress who are indeed swayed by anything and everything that promotes their own self interests.  Politics is supposedly the art of compromise.  What I'm watching now appears to be the art of reelection, subsidies, greed, arrogance, and down right stupidity...............  No I haven't read the bill either.  Way too big and depressing.  I most certainly would if that was what I was elected to do.  That's what members of congress and their elaborate staff are paid to do.
 
This upcoming vote reminds me of a historical shuttle launch as the clock keeps starting and stopping.  I suppose they're in the restrooms mustering up the POLITICAL COURAGE to say YES I CAN or NO I WON'T.  Those RETIRING or not running for reelection will cast their votes no matter what the outcome.  It's amazing how quick they'll take off their packs while still drawing a government pay check...........
 
I don't envy future members of congress because they'll have a whole host of bloated and out of control programs to unscrew.  What an uphill battle........... 

Offline fish

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Offline shadylane

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2010, 11:39:43 PM »
Guess I'll join this conversation since I've been called lazy and uninformed.
"The problem with America is stupidity. I'm not saying there should be a capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?"

Offline matrsnot

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2010, 12:28:33 AM »
The health bill, auto take over, bank take over and the wild spending are all part of the plan to have the government control all of us.  Please look at those in the military.  When a new officer comes on board and he has not the faintest idea of how to run things, he centralizes so he has control over all actions.  This is no different.  Those voting for health care tonight should count themselves traitors to the country and the Constitution they swore to protect and defend.

Offline Vado Del Rio

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2010, 01:12:35 AM »
The health bill, auto take over, bank take over and the wild spending are all part of the plan to have the government control all of us.  Please look at those in the military.  When a new officer comes on board and he has not the faintest idea of how to run things, he centralizes so he has control over all actions.  This is no different.  Those voting for health care tonight should count themselves traitors to the country and the Constitution they swore to protect and defend.

Those who vote the party line are followers, not leaders.  Members of congress should think and vote on their own two feet, regardless of threats made by the senior followership.  Leaders will be elected/reelected when the chips are down, especially if we hit ROCK BOTTOM.  Followers will either flee, RETIRE, blame others, or seek reelection in a state or district that borders the Pacific or Atlantic.

Offline prE4chEr

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #11 on: March 22, 2010, 11:15:26 AM »
Those voting for health care tonight should count themselves traitors to the country and the Constitution they swore to protect and defend.

Why should they consider themselves traitors? Our founding fathers created a socialized health care system. In July of 1978 congress passed and John Adams signed into law a socialized health care system for seamen. You can't call people who vote for socialized health care today traitors to the country when the people who created the foundation of this country voted for socialized health care too.
 
http://open.salon.com/blog/paul_j_orourke/2009/07/22/our_founding_fathers_socialist_healthcare_system
 
"Our Founders realized that a healthy work force was essential to our economic health and growth. It was for this reason that, in July of 1798, Congress passed, and President John Adams signed into law an act “For the Relief of Sick and Disabled Seamen,” establishing the Marine Hospital Service.
 
This Federal government socialized healthcare insurance was funded by a tax that was withheld from the sailor’s pay, and then turned over to the government by the ship’s owner. This first payroll tax amounted to slightly over 1% of the sailor’s wages. An injured or sick sailor would make a claim, his record of payments would be confirmed, and he would be given a “chit” for admission to the local hospital. Some of these healthcare facilities were private, but in the larger ports Federal maritime hospitals were built."
(\__/)
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Offline fish

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2010, 02:49:16 AM »
and where are they now preach? gone
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_Hospital_Service

great example of socialized health care program. thanks!!!

Offline prE4chEr

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #13 on: March 23, 2010, 01:57:39 PM »
and where are they now preach? gone
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_Hospital_Service

great example of socialized health care program. thanks!!!


Did you even read that article? The program still exists today. It is currently called the United States Public Health Service. They changed the name to better express the broadening responsibilities of the program.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Health_Service#History
(\__/)
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Offline fish

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #14 on: March 24, 2010, 01:57:23 AM »
the program no longer served it's purpose. another failed government program. the mission changed , it includes well beyond it's original intent. just bureacracy to keep a failed program alive.

Offline Just_a_Biker

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Re: A Strong Lesson from Argentina
« Reply #15 on: March 24, 2010, 02:06:25 AM »
... just bureacracy to keep a failed program alive.

That's the part of government that disgusts me...  I've seen millions of dollars get flushed down the toilet because of egos and people not willing to admit something has run its course, or isn't what it was supposed to be in the first place...
The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest Rome become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance. Cicero - 55 BC, Rome